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Post by voxpops on May 21, 2020 1:09:47 GMT -5
What are others take on this question and answer? It asks about how to determine the starting place. My take is Forrest is saying there is something else in the poem hinting to where warm waters halt. There's been a bunch of talk on this but is the hint from the other poem clues taking you to the chest or is it a hint that is not one of poem nine clues that pinpoints a specific starting place? I think you're right about other hints in the poem pointing to WWWH. I also think they tie in to Forrest's refusal to talk about whether the treasure is hidden or buried. The trouble is, they are not definitive. I also think it's worth remembering that FF said: "If you don't know where it is, go back to the first clue." This line became extremely important for me in the latter stages of my hunt. Most of us suspect that the poem contains mirror motifs or mechanisms. What I didn't expect was that they would also apply to the two most fundamental clues: the beginning and end. The effect of this is to demand that you find the end first. And as counterintuitive as this seems, it reveals something about the nature of this quest. IMO, you cannot enter the resting place of the treasure without the "key," and in order to find the "key" you need to nail down WWWH, as well as the intermediary locations. So the end is only the beginning, so to speak. In practice this means that you need to find the end using a false or substitute WWWH. And as bizarre as it sounds, that's not impossible. Think about it this way: there is no definitive pointer to WWWH that searchers have been able to unearth in the poem. Despite strong confidence, every search (including my own) has failed to find the treasure chest. So what was missing? The TRUE WWWH. And without the true WWWH, you cannot complete the job. So if you can find the end first, and then establish the poem's real starting point, that is why you will be "more than half way to the treasure, metaphorically speaking." It is also why the clues become progressively easier after that.
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Post by voxpops on May 12, 2020 14:56:55 GMT -5
forrest said the first clue is the hardest to find. several have found it. what's up with the others if they are easier to find. They aren't. Searcher progress (or the lack thereof) after solving the first two clues is evidence of that. Halogetter and I have recently been discussing the poem difficulty issue over on Dal's: dalneitzel.com/2019/06/16/the-poem-part-seven/#comment-939129Although I would have agreed with this a while back, I now think that Forrest's assertion re clue difficulty was correct. It's very easy to fool yourself that you have the correct WWWH, and then what follows is the usual crow pie (I have the T-shirt!). Nailing WWWH is probably only going to happen after years of work. All the effort put in before that is to attune the mind so that you'll recognize it eventually, IMO. It may even be necessary to establish a "home base" before WWWH is understood fully in terms of geography, relationship to the poem/map, and significance. I think it would actually be counterproductive to "stumble" on it at the beginning of one's chase, which may very well be why people have been unable to progress beyond the first two clues, or have been unaware of where they were. Once WWWH becomes evident and forms part of your "big picture", you will probably have the tools ready to progress fairly rapidly after that. I think one of the problems is that we tend to limit our thinking due to preconceptions and habit. I know that's something I've struggled with. The other thing to remember is that Forrest was not "playing games" when he established the Chase. There is a purpose behind this treasure hunt and an overarching theme. We need to tap into that to be able to make progress. If you like to use the goldilocks analogy, the poem is "just right" because it fulfills its function perfectly, being unsolvable without the key. So how do you find the key? You have to ask.
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Post by voxpops on May 6, 2020 13:04:48 GMT -5
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaff_(countermeasure)I've spent a bit of time thinking about this site, and had one communication with the operator. I now believe that there are aspects of it that are genuine, and parts that are designed to deflect. My honest opinion is that although the chest has not yet been retrieved, we are entering the final stages of the chase, and work is ongoing behind the scenes. Things may be clearer in the not-too-distant future (virus permitting). All of the above is opinion and should not be confused with fact!
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Post by voxpops on May 6, 2020 4:25:59 GMT -5
"For an aged kid from Texas, the Palm Springs experience was both ego shrinking and mind expanding."
"Don't let your ego take you beyond your limit"
And who remembers the time FF told a woman that she could either have the treasure chest or her ego?
IMO, finding what lies beyond the insincerity and trickery of the ego is the most fundamental aspect of the Chase. Scrapbook 128 points the way IMO.
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Post by voxpops on May 6, 2020 4:07:32 GMT -5
Another quote that points towards the idea of multiple personalities/split personality etc is:
"Occasionally it's wise for the fox to dress like the hound." (p7)
Daffodil. Onetime. My two sense.
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Post by voxpops on May 5, 2020 7:26:26 GMT -5
I think the most logical explanation is that Forrest hired a ghostwriter. In a way maybe you're right. But where do you suppose you could find a ghostwriter who could pen such an amazing piece of work and foil all attempts to unravel the true meaning over ten years?
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Post by voxpops on May 5, 2020 7:20:04 GMT -5
To a greater or lesser degree I think we all have a divided personality. The very fact that FF decided to use two handles for blog posting points toward this as potentially important. I believe it's fundamental to the chase. How many times has the concept of twins, double letters, repeated words, mirrors etc. come up?
This idea also makes it easier to interpret who wrote the poem, and who, by extension, hid the treasure. It wasn't Forrest. At least, it wasn't the ego who goes by the name of Forrest Fenn. By the same token, it won't be an ego that discovers it.
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Post by voxpops on May 1, 2020 3:36:20 GMT -5
“My trees already think it’s summer and I’ll not be the one to tell them different.” Does someone think their solve is correct and are the trees (with their solve being summer), and who is Forrest to tell them different? What are y’all’s thoughts on this? Very perceptive lbkgoat, I never spotted that. Impatience can be expensive! It's probably better to be wise first.
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Post by voxpops on Apr 30, 2020 9:42:07 GMT -5
Two bodies in space. They are getting closer to one another, but only one of them is moving. If there were no other objects to act as reference points, how would we ascertain which of the two is in motion? From each point of view the only thing that could be said is that the opposing object is nearing (or drawing nigh). I don't make this point to be coy or clever, but to illustrate what I believe to be an aspect of the hunt that may be important. "Just close your eyes." You captured my curiosity. Is this able to be a map based solve but still have relative references, You pretty much nailed it, astree. It is most definitely map based with relative references. However, it also has a little something extra - something that moves beyond the relative. FF, being the master of the double entendre, sometimes goes for triple, and I think that's the case with his latest Q&A. I think that the ending may be the most imaginative part of the whole enterprise, and we will need to "close our eyes" in every sense of those words.
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Post by voxpops on Apr 29, 2020 23:34:13 GMT -5
Two bodies in space. They are getting closer to one another, but only one of them is moving. If there were no other objects to act as reference points, how would we ascertain which of the two is in motion? From each point of view the only thing that could be said is that the opposing object is nearing (or drawing nigh).
I don't make this point to be coy or clever, but to illustrate what I believe to be an aspect of the hunt that may be important. "Just close your eyes."
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Post by voxpops on Apr 23, 2020 10:20:10 GMT -5
The surprise may come from how it's hidden, not where just saying. Maybe. And possibly how it can be accessed.
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Post by voxpops on Apr 23, 2020 9:34:06 GMT -5
Could it simply be because it’s no where near as remote as most would think? In fact it may be near a heavily trafficked area? Forrest once said that searchers are looking so far ahead that they're missing what's right in front of them. Didn't he say that they're looking so far into the "future?" That shifts the meaning subtly, and it's a word that most people seem to overlook, tending to read it as a distance measurement rather than time.
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Post by voxpops on Apr 23, 2020 6:23:48 GMT -5
I think you hit the nail on the head! You need both. If you don't have the key, your assault will likely be repelled. The indigo shrub; or the indigo dye obtained from the plant.
It is interesting that "a nail" may be equated with "indigo"
In the woad? I'm only half-joking...
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Post by voxpops on Apr 23, 2020 6:21:26 GMT -5
Nothing I have ever heard or read has ever made me think that Forrest parked his car at WWWH (as a necessary step in hiding the treasure). I absolutely think Forrest was using "followed" in a figurative sense, as he indicated was possible when he stated that "It is not likely that anyone will find it without following the clues, at least in their mind." (In other words, the nine clues can be "followed" physically and mentally, but perhaps as many as eight of them can be followed just mentally -- though we also know "a physical presence is needed to complete the solve." This is why the LGFI can get "closer" than the first two clues, as long as she doesn't let her thinking get in a rut.) I also think this is about as clearcut as it gets: "You have to find out where the first clue is: where warm waters halt. That’s the first clue, and then take it from there." (And "begin it" there and "take it from there," etc., suggest to me that WWWH is where you start the journey defined by the path from the first clue/location to the ninth clue/location. So "first" is not about level of importance or degree of emphasis or anything else. It's simply "first" in the common-sense, ordinal definition of the term -- the kind of thing an "average person" would understand.) This also seems very straightforward to me: "The first clue in my poem is WWWH. I have said that several times over the years. If you can’t find that location you cannot find the treasure." Personally, I think about it like this. Someone has given us directions along the lines of "Start where First Avenue intersects with Main Street and head north several blocks. Turn right just past the brown building. Then go down that street and watch out for the potholes. Take a left and you will pass the railroad tracks and the public swimming pool. Then, once you've seen the big neon sign, get close to it and start looking for the building with the red door." (He's gone into that building by himself a few times, and it's where he went with the package he left for us to go pick up.) This person also published a book in which he told us that we'll find the correct intersection of First and Main in a small town somewhere west of the Mississippi River. He also included some hints that might help us identify that town, and he's indicated that we can find the town on a good map (which we'll probably need to do in order to make our way to it from our driveway). And, of course, we'll need the complete directions because there are many small towns west of the Mississippi with an intersecting First and Main, but fewer with a brown building several blocks north, even fewer with a perpendicular road with potholes, etc., and only one with an obviously correct neon sign and a nearby building with a red door -- and we'll need to correctly identify all of those locations before we know for sure that we have the correct starting location. (If we stop navel-gazing and start looking at the big picture, we'll understand all of this.) I know this might be the wrong way of thinking about the chase. But if it's not, why expend so much energy trying to establish whether the intersection of First and Main is a full clue or maybe just a partial clue? To me, that looks like a lot of overthinking (and thus overcomplicating) the problem. Great Discussion! Love the example of 'why' the big picture is needed. And it is for that reason we look at all the many things 'on Forrest', because if we can find any hint towards narrowing down the numerous options, it will help..... I agree that it's really well put. But... From my point of view it was absolutely essential for FF to visit all three of the key locations: WWWH, hoB, and the hiding place. Missing out any one of those would not have accomplished his aim. IT wasn't just about hiding treasure, but influencing the future. As a consequence, I think it would be advisable for a confident searcher to start (physically) at the first clue, but then it's absolutely essential to "Put in below the home of Brown." Without doing that, I don't believe it's possible to get to the treasure. We shouldn't forget that FF agreed that it's like a scavenger hunt. This is connected to the reason that a physical presence is necessary to complete the solve.
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Post by voxpops on Apr 23, 2020 5:47:18 GMT -5
Putting the revised versions of statements 1) and 2) together suggests that all that has be done, is to find the key and the identity of the Castle of Love and the location of the chest is found.
I think you hit the nail on the head! You need both. If you don't have the key, your assault will likely be repelled.
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