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Post by diceycat on Sept 19, 2022 11:48:15 GMT -5
The only thing more convincing would be a casque in hand Now I do realize that the Blacksmith exhibit is current but can’t say for certain if there was one there 40 years ago. There may have been or just another structure none the less.
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Post by canuck on Sept 19, 2022 17:54:13 GMT -5
Have you used Historic Aerials before on your theories? Early 1980s aerials don’t show development in that area. Most of that area wasn’t developed until 2005 onward according to the air photos available for that area. What in that area gets you to a precise dig spot? Are you lining 2 fixed objects up and using an intersect?
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Post by diceycat on Sept 19, 2022 23:00:27 GMT -5
I find for this area that the early historic aerials are of poor and low quality as to be able to make out any structures in the park. I’m sure there must have been something for the tourists to see. The current owner would be able to confirm this possibility or if someone had a map of the park back then in 1980. It’s possible that a hurricane could have taken out a structure or something else happened to it if there was a structure there. Might be blocked by trees. Too small to discern from an aerial view back in 1983. I was thinking about that number “24” at the central point in the painting and how the number might apply (in the past), to one of the sites in the park that you see now numbered on a FOY map. Again not sure if the park even made maps back then.
What gets me to the precise spot is the shape of the island in the painting matches the shape of the land in that corner ( see my first few posts how I got to this corner ) so look for the palm tree in the corner align it up with the great cross ,so the dig spot should be at the base of the palm tree while facing the palm tree with the great cross aligned with it.
If you entered the park and looked south ( assuming you are far enough north of the palm) then the palm tree could be superimposed onto the Great Cross and that would make sense why the palm tree is tinged blue. The first time you would see the tree.
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Post by choice on Sept 19, 2022 23:32:26 GMT -5
The problem with that spot is you'd be looking at the cross practically in profile because it's facing the church by the arched bridge.
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Post by diceycat on Sept 20, 2022 6:56:38 GMT -5
Does it really matter if you see the cross face on? It’s still a cross and you see enough of it to know it’s a cross ( see the shadow cast by the cross on the water on GE). Again assuming that there is a cross in the palm tree. I like to think there is and so do others. It’s just another theory that needs to be checked off the list of theories out there.
If I was so inclined to dig for any of the casques and find one ,I would keep the entire thing and forget about the jewel. How many people could say they have a key. The casque with a key probably holds more value.
Personally, I think BP wanted people to open up a dictionary to find the meaning of words. For example if you search for the definition of “eye” you will find a write up on peacocks and the eye in the feather. Subtle hints possibly. Take a look at the definition of “Home” in the Webster’s dictionary and #6 on the list is HOME PLATE…. really! Look up the definition of “ beat” and you will read in the Webster’s as in “beat a drum” . Sure there are a few possibilities but the clue is in the definition.
That’s why I looked up the definition of “TRIP”. It states a voyage or journey. Now of course it is ,but that’s not how most would think to describe a trip. The “TRIP” acrostic applies to the Roanoke puzzle for those wondering.
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Post by choice on Sept 20, 2022 10:26:36 GMT -5
Does it really matter if you see the cross face on? To me it does since the painting shows it as face on. Your mileage may vary. This also limits the dig area between the cross and the church.
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Post by diceycat on Sept 20, 2022 14:08:05 GMT -5
It’s all theory till you have a casque to prove otherwise. Not saying your wrong . It’s a good theory, better than most but still theory. I look at other theories,( most people don’t post anything, or just snippets of theories ) and try to see if it fits logically . Can you see the verse story in the painting and from the dig site. Not all clues in the painting can be seen from the dig site like the Boston pops . Some just might get you to the general area. Most over think the puzzles. Look for patterns ( template). Then again 40 years of changes. Back in the day you only had a history book/ current events, a dictionary, a map/ geography book and the great novels/ art work of the past as a reference source.
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Post by choice on Sept 20, 2022 15:07:50 GMT -5
Back in the day you only had a history book/ current events, a dictionary, a map/ geography book and the great novels/ art work of the past as a reference source. You also had your eyeballs and you could see where the cross is facing. BTW similarly San Francisco dig site may be where a giant golden cross was facing. It’s all theory till you have a casque to prove otherwise!
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Post by diceycat on Sept 22, 2022 11:32:23 GMT -5
I think I have it narrowed down now. Treat the location of the palm tree like you would home plate in Boston. For Boston you aligned the Old North Church with the port hole of the USS Constitution ( draw a line),and you crossed over home plate. For St.Augustine you draw a line from the ticket office/ entrance to the FOY park to the Great Cross and you cross over the palm tree. So let me explain here. Look at the last 5 lines of the verse: “Sails pass by night “ If you didn’t know better that the Great Cross was a religious cross that’s viewed from a side angle from the park and distorted ( elongated) one might think ( if you were a typical teen), it’s the mast of a tall ship. “Even in darkness Like moonlight in tear drops” The Cross is illuminated at night ( so he’s burying it at night) The lights you see projected would be elongated like a teardrop coming to a point on the top of the cross “ Over the tall grass” This would indicate direction and possibly tall grass ( vegetation) by the waters edge “ Years pass, rain falls” This indicates the ticket office/ entrance where you buy your admission to see the “rain falls” aka the Fountain of Youth drinking fountain. That’s why he probably formulated the acrostic SELOY for those lines to add significance to it. So if you were standing closer to the park entrance and looking toward that palm tree and aligned the palm tree ( off in a distance) with the cross ( even further away) then you you would get that overlap of the palm tree and cross in the painting and a reason to put a bluish tinge to the palm tree cause your view is from far away.
You even see the bridge off in a distance to the south of the Cross
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Post by diceycat on Sept 26, 2022 7:50:10 GMT -5
Just another pic to show the tall grass , boats , great cross and view point. The palm tree is probably long gone .
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Post by diceycat on Nov 4, 2022 22:18:22 GMT -5
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Post by diceycat on Nov 7, 2022 22:26:53 GMT -5
OK , after much more research from Q4T and pics and videos, I see that there were no peacocks in the park in the 1980s and no concrete sea wall. Thanks to “ Stercox”, “Sawdusty” and “ Egbert” for posting pics and vital information See thread “ Verse 9” on Q4T , there is a link in PB Works site. With my theory that the casque location is in the centre of the painting that would put the location down by the restroom / ticket area for the park . In the section( Menendez pocket park) of the property that requires no admission fee. That should make some treasure hunters happy. One should still ask for permission to probe and dig. The number 24 that one sees in the painting in the centre, might tie into the seconds of the latitude reading even though it actually reads about 25 in this spot. So is it in this section of the park? Kind of makes sense. There are a few tall trees there. Did any trees there fall down in the past during a hurricane? One can only guess and check the area well. I’m sure others have poked around this area, This would be the most logical place to search. Most of the verse seems to fit objects along the Avenue of palms. Its possible that it could also be at the southern end of the Ave. of Palms we’re the road turns to go to the west ( the area of the jewel in the birds eye). More likely it’s not there. I think that the jewel in the birds eye is telling us to view the painting as a map from above ,( a birds eye view), and the fact that the bird appears to look closer to a pea fowl than a goose then that might be a play on words for one to think restroom. Or is it a parrot/ bird of paradise as in the plant. The jewel somehow ties into the dig site location. Let’s look at the horse with the drooping head that we see at the lower end of the painting. It’s a close match for the 2nd sorrow of the Virgin Mary . So does this tie into the church yard by the FOY park or does it represent something like “ you can lead a horse to water but you can’t make him drink it”, usually ties into some spring water/ oasis, or since the second sorrow was called the “flight to Egypt” is it a representation for the EXIT from the park. The next possible theory goes like this. The central point in the painting lands on the skeletal thumb. That’s odd since there are no human burial sites by the restroom. If we draw lines from corner to corner on the painting we see the one line crosses the so called island ( oyster midden), with the palm tree , over the skeleton hand , along the second thumb and past the back of the birds head. If you drew a line on the aerial view of the the park from the proposed dig site by the restroom toward the great cross you will see that line go over the burial site. This is probably one reason why you have the skeletal arm. Next, why the thumb? Well in art ( see attached definition ) we raise the thumb to size objects off in the distance. My guess is back then if you stood at the central point by the restroom area you could see through the trees , maybe a palm tree off in the distance blocking the great cross and this might be the palm tree that holds the casque . The palm tree by the waters edge. Again it’s all theory. In one pic below you can see the fountain ( rain falls?), with the couple holding the umbrella and through the trees you can see what looks like the water. This fountain was close to the possible restroom dig site. Again you have that other thumb the non skeletal one. . I’ll call it the hitchhiker’s thumb telling you to go in this direction. Going my way. Why would JJP paint the island/ oyster shell and palm tree by the water in that bluish tone of colour unless that is where to look by the water for this tree.
The outdoor fountain just south of the Menendez pocket park The center piece has since been replaced
Menendez pocket park area
Is the great cross illuminated at night your “moonlight in teardrops” or is it the lamp post light in the pocket park or maybe the white dome of the planetarium as it appears above the fountain? Or do they shut the fountain off at night?
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Post by diceycat on Nov 13, 2022 20:57:26 GMT -5
Here’s another possibility for those numbers 2 and 4 that we see at the central point in the painting. Some think those numbers might pertain to lumber as in a 2X4 piece of wood that’s used in construction. Now most 2X4s are made from pine, spruce or fir trees. Certainly other types of wood can be made into a 2X4 but it’s not common. So if we look up trees in Florida, pine spruce and fir we find that apparently there are a few types and one is the native Spruce pine tree . There appears to be a tall Spruce pine tree at about the correct location in that south section of the Menendez pocket park.
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Post by diceycat on Nov 13, 2022 21:16:30 GMT -5
I’m going to post another possibility . Even though I think all casques are in parks. You have JJPs initials at the lower right corner in the painting. At the skeleton elbow. Now you see the black section of the elbow. Black means the end . Now if we look along the wall of the church yard you see black areas and you see how the fence bends ( elbow like),around that stump,( the base of a tall tree) The parking lot on the opposite side has almost an island like shape. So this stump area would be a possible location for the casque.
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wbgrimesii
Junior Member
I have several solves but need someone like Josh Gates to get permission to dig for one of them.
Posts: 88
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Post by wbgrimesii on Nov 14, 2022 12:21:10 GMT -5
In your pic of the 2 4..could the v of the 4 be verse and does it point to a representation of 1 and 0. For verse 10
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