Post by whoknows on Dec 22, 2020 15:15:18 GMT -5
I thought of a good possible area in Grand Teton per an earlier post. In light of more thought and considering the poem and comments more carefully, there may be another area that fits better. Teton seemed good with the clues lining up but the laws as to found property and the summer crowds seem to make it unlikely after all.
Given this is still an intellectual challenge, and if it is okay with you, Ill add in a few hints rather than state my partial "new" solve. Ill add more in response to yours and maybe we can all actually figure this out for curiosity sake.
My hints may help others who have more familiarity with the area take it farther on the ground without being biased by my conclusion. Please post your comments in response and see if we can put this together.
As I have gone alone in there
And with my treasures bold,
I can keep my secret where,
And hint of riches new and old.
Fenn says no hints here. But "alone in there" and bold suggest he entered some closed sort of area -- not a cave or mine as Fenn ruled out but maybe a valley that goes into and ends in a large mountain. Maybe a bowl or V shaped valley having one single easy entrance and exit. The spot is not out on the open plains; it is "in there."
Begin it where warm waters halt
And take it in the canyon down,
Not far, but too far to walk.
Put in below the home of Brown.
Like the rest of the poem, the sentences and clues need to be read together and not in isolation. Fenn seems to say this at the end of the poem when he says to "hear me all and listen good." Listen carefully to all he says as if he is reading to poem to you.
Do warm waters mixing with cold waters "halt?" Maybe and maybe not. Maybe Fenn intended to mean something besides mixing.
This seems to be the huge clue that limits the area to only one state, which we now know as Wyoming. It also seems to narrow down the area to a distinct portion of Wyoming. Fenn's intended idea of "halt" would rule out every other area in the Fenn map. However, "halt" can happen multiple places elsewhere in the lower 48.
Could warm waters refer to a season of the year? Could "halt" be similar to abruptly stopping in one's tracks? How could this clue act in a way to limit the area to Wyoming and in fact to a very specific area of the state?
Now, try to couple together "Begin it where warm waters halt" and "And take it in the canyon down." Keep in mind that there is no punctuation after "halt." In fact the "halt" line is the only that does not have punctuation. While "And" on the next line beings with a cap, all lines begin with a cap.
The lack of punctuation after "halt" is a hint that the "halt" line and "canyon down" line are to be read as one single line.
Could this single line comprised of the "halt" line and "canyon down" line narrow down the "halt" line alone to say less than 100 places?? Maybe less than 50 places, if you assume Fenn placed the chest in such an area to minimize fire damage, avoid flooding and the chest being carried away (even though it was in a wet area of some sort), avoid readily discovery, and avoid land slides?
Fenn says the hints on these lines could take one to within say 1,000 feet of the hiding spot. Does this narrow things down even more? Does this single line provide the overview for the travel from well traveled public road to "in there?"
Also, at this stage, would it not be appropriate to narrow down based on Fenn's statement about how far the hiding spot was from his car or truck? Remember, Not far, but too far to walk.
It seems from the internet that several possibilities emerge with "halt" and "canyon down" not being more than a few miles apart.
Home of Brown. This is seems to be a tough one to figure out. Is brown the color of a home or small building, a color of the ground, related to a historical figure and a legendary event, maybe descriptive of a place that is not named Brown?
Not sure but it looks like the shortest road access from "halt" to "canyon down" may be a little iffy with perhaps a blockage, but that, in passing from "halt" to "canyon down" indirectly via other roads one might go through a place that might relate to Brown and in fact a second place nearby that also does relate to Brown, a person and lost legend, although not a great fit for "home" in the sense of permanent home or source of "Brown." It might just relate to something one might see if they were physically there though.
From there it’s no place for the meek: Could it be that one enters the canyon down at "brown?" Now you would be going "in there" with perhaps enhanced risk.
Could "not meek" refer to legendary brave historical figures; people risking grave injury, disease, and death on the quest to something better? Maybe meek also relates to an unpopulated isolated area where getting lost could be a very big problem. Maybe it relates to driving on little used roads that might be in very poor condition, where the risk of a flat tire, no cell service, and very few people around at all presents a risk that is too much for the meek? Maybe there is at least some danger from predatory animals, which would keep the meek out.
The end is ever drawing nigh;
Nigh seems to be either left or soon. Is the end where the treasure was hidden? Or, could the end mean a boundary beyond which for various legal reasons the treasure was not hidden?
There’ll be no paddle up your creek,
Just heavy loads and water high.
Maybe combine "not meek" with "heavy loads" to begin with. How about brave people traveling with heavy loads as a hint to help narrow down the area?
Maybe "no paddle" means just that -- a small creek with various obstructions such that it would never make sense to paddle.
If you’ve been wise and found the blaze,
Look quickly down, your quest to cease,
But tarry scant with marvel gaze,
Just take the chest and go in peace.
If you’ve been wise and found the blaze: From the comments about declining to describe the blaze as giving up too much of a secret, what might this tell you about the size and uniqueness of the blaze?
A blaze on a tree in the open woods, even if described as that, does not narrow down much land to search. It also is not that permanent as described by Fenn's comments.
How about a huge blaze that really narrows down the area from the "halt" and "canyon down" part of the poem? Maybe the blaze confirms one's suspicions?
Note that, while the hints are supposed to be sequential, the "blaze" line is in past tense: basically look down (at the end) if you have seen the blaze and if you were wise.
This is not clear, but could the "end," if it is a boundary, be memorialized by markers that one might also be called "blazes?" So, in a sense you are at the right place if you satisfy the first two lines of the Poem, you have seen the large and unique blaze, and reached the end, which may be a marked boundary.
Again, maybe the end is the headwaters of the creek? Maybe the end is both a boundary and headwaters?
Wise:
Something to do with owls? Intelligence, sharp, quick, experienced, good judgment? I did not see any fit. Maybe wise relates to those who are not meek and who carried heavy loads. Maybe wise relates to property rights held by the finder in the treasure in the sense that the finder researched the law as it applies to various landholdings to try to narrow down areas which have applicable laws more in favor of the finder.
Wise as in clockwise? Could it be that, if the shortest road from the beginning to the end were less practical in favor of a combination of other slightly longer roads, could it be that Fenn is saying to travel down a road in a clockwise direction past the blaze?
So why is it that I must go
And leave my trove for all to seek?
The answers I already know,
I’ve done it tired, and now I’m weak.
This does not seem to have locational clues. Perhaps this relates to his cancer diagnosis and eventual recovery and the initial thought he might just like to go to the spot to die in the presence of incredible beauty and peace.
So hear me all and listen good,
Your effort will be worth the cold.
If you are brave and in the wood
I give you title to the gold.
"[H]ear me all and listen good" seems to mean to take each and every word of the poem as being important and likely intertwined. Listen carefully to all words.
Your effort will be worth the cold.
If you are brave and in the wood
I give you title to the gold.
Searching in a woody wet area would seem to fit "cold" and "wood." Not only do the other clues have to point to an area, but it is going to be wet, maybe foggy, probably with cold water, involve woods/trees/forest, and brave is "not for the meek."
Think about it? Anybody have some narrowed down areas in light of the above?
One final hint: I could find no mention of the area in any solves I am thinking of, or anything even close.
Yes, it does seem to fit Fenn clues as to elevation, no buildings, trails, caves, mines. It may not be the spot or solve but seems to have a fairly close match.
What do you think?
Given this is still an intellectual challenge, and if it is okay with you, Ill add in a few hints rather than state my partial "new" solve. Ill add more in response to yours and maybe we can all actually figure this out for curiosity sake.
My hints may help others who have more familiarity with the area take it farther on the ground without being biased by my conclusion. Please post your comments in response and see if we can put this together.
As I have gone alone in there
And with my treasures bold,
I can keep my secret where,
And hint of riches new and old.
Fenn says no hints here. But "alone in there" and bold suggest he entered some closed sort of area -- not a cave or mine as Fenn ruled out but maybe a valley that goes into and ends in a large mountain. Maybe a bowl or V shaped valley having one single easy entrance and exit. The spot is not out on the open plains; it is "in there."
Begin it where warm waters halt
And take it in the canyon down,
Not far, but too far to walk.
Put in below the home of Brown.
Like the rest of the poem, the sentences and clues need to be read together and not in isolation. Fenn seems to say this at the end of the poem when he says to "hear me all and listen good." Listen carefully to all he says as if he is reading to poem to you.
Do warm waters mixing with cold waters "halt?" Maybe and maybe not. Maybe Fenn intended to mean something besides mixing.
This seems to be the huge clue that limits the area to only one state, which we now know as Wyoming. It also seems to narrow down the area to a distinct portion of Wyoming. Fenn's intended idea of "halt" would rule out every other area in the Fenn map. However, "halt" can happen multiple places elsewhere in the lower 48.
Could warm waters refer to a season of the year? Could "halt" be similar to abruptly stopping in one's tracks? How could this clue act in a way to limit the area to Wyoming and in fact to a very specific area of the state?
Now, try to couple together "Begin it where warm waters halt" and "And take it in the canyon down." Keep in mind that there is no punctuation after "halt." In fact the "halt" line is the only that does not have punctuation. While "And" on the next line beings with a cap, all lines begin with a cap.
The lack of punctuation after "halt" is a hint that the "halt" line and "canyon down" line are to be read as one single line.
Could this single line comprised of the "halt" line and "canyon down" line narrow down the "halt" line alone to say less than 100 places?? Maybe less than 50 places, if you assume Fenn placed the chest in such an area to minimize fire damage, avoid flooding and the chest being carried away (even though it was in a wet area of some sort), avoid readily discovery, and avoid land slides?
Fenn says the hints on these lines could take one to within say 1,000 feet of the hiding spot. Does this narrow things down even more? Does this single line provide the overview for the travel from well traveled public road to "in there?"
Also, at this stage, would it not be appropriate to narrow down based on Fenn's statement about how far the hiding spot was from his car or truck? Remember, Not far, but too far to walk.
It seems from the internet that several possibilities emerge with "halt" and "canyon down" not being more than a few miles apart.
Home of Brown. This is seems to be a tough one to figure out. Is brown the color of a home or small building, a color of the ground, related to a historical figure and a legendary event, maybe descriptive of a place that is not named Brown?
Not sure but it looks like the shortest road access from "halt" to "canyon down" may be a little iffy with perhaps a blockage, but that, in passing from "halt" to "canyon down" indirectly via other roads one might go through a place that might relate to Brown and in fact a second place nearby that also does relate to Brown, a person and lost legend, although not a great fit for "home" in the sense of permanent home or source of "Brown." It might just relate to something one might see if they were physically there though.
From there it’s no place for the meek: Could it be that one enters the canyon down at "brown?" Now you would be going "in there" with perhaps enhanced risk.
Could "not meek" refer to legendary brave historical figures; people risking grave injury, disease, and death on the quest to something better? Maybe meek also relates to an unpopulated isolated area where getting lost could be a very big problem. Maybe it relates to driving on little used roads that might be in very poor condition, where the risk of a flat tire, no cell service, and very few people around at all presents a risk that is too much for the meek? Maybe there is at least some danger from predatory animals, which would keep the meek out.
The end is ever drawing nigh;
Nigh seems to be either left or soon. Is the end where the treasure was hidden? Or, could the end mean a boundary beyond which for various legal reasons the treasure was not hidden?
There’ll be no paddle up your creek,
Just heavy loads and water high.
Maybe combine "not meek" with "heavy loads" to begin with. How about brave people traveling with heavy loads as a hint to help narrow down the area?
Maybe "no paddle" means just that -- a small creek with various obstructions such that it would never make sense to paddle.
If you’ve been wise and found the blaze,
Look quickly down, your quest to cease,
But tarry scant with marvel gaze,
Just take the chest and go in peace.
If you’ve been wise and found the blaze: From the comments about declining to describe the blaze as giving up too much of a secret, what might this tell you about the size and uniqueness of the blaze?
A blaze on a tree in the open woods, even if described as that, does not narrow down much land to search. It also is not that permanent as described by Fenn's comments.
How about a huge blaze that really narrows down the area from the "halt" and "canyon down" part of the poem? Maybe the blaze confirms one's suspicions?
Note that, while the hints are supposed to be sequential, the "blaze" line is in past tense: basically look down (at the end) if you have seen the blaze and if you were wise.
This is not clear, but could the "end," if it is a boundary, be memorialized by markers that one might also be called "blazes?" So, in a sense you are at the right place if you satisfy the first two lines of the Poem, you have seen the large and unique blaze, and reached the end, which may be a marked boundary.
Again, maybe the end is the headwaters of the creek? Maybe the end is both a boundary and headwaters?
Wise:
Something to do with owls? Intelligence, sharp, quick, experienced, good judgment? I did not see any fit. Maybe wise relates to those who are not meek and who carried heavy loads. Maybe wise relates to property rights held by the finder in the treasure in the sense that the finder researched the law as it applies to various landholdings to try to narrow down areas which have applicable laws more in favor of the finder.
Wise as in clockwise? Could it be that, if the shortest road from the beginning to the end were less practical in favor of a combination of other slightly longer roads, could it be that Fenn is saying to travel down a road in a clockwise direction past the blaze?
So why is it that I must go
And leave my trove for all to seek?
The answers I already know,
I’ve done it tired, and now I’m weak.
This does not seem to have locational clues. Perhaps this relates to his cancer diagnosis and eventual recovery and the initial thought he might just like to go to the spot to die in the presence of incredible beauty and peace.
So hear me all and listen good,
Your effort will be worth the cold.
If you are brave and in the wood
I give you title to the gold.
"[H]ear me all and listen good" seems to mean to take each and every word of the poem as being important and likely intertwined. Listen carefully to all words.
Your effort will be worth the cold.
If you are brave and in the wood
I give you title to the gold.
Searching in a woody wet area would seem to fit "cold" and "wood." Not only do the other clues have to point to an area, but it is going to be wet, maybe foggy, probably with cold water, involve woods/trees/forest, and brave is "not for the meek."
Think about it? Anybody have some narrowed down areas in light of the above?
One final hint: I could find no mention of the area in any solves I am thinking of, or anything even close.
Yes, it does seem to fit Fenn clues as to elevation, no buildings, trails, caves, mines. It may not be the spot or solve but seems to have a fairly close match.
What do you think?
