Why does FF not give the solution to the poem?

[dalby2020]

A formal post-chase contest would be fun. Have Forrest set up a central website where searchers can state where they thought the treasure was. There would be a strict word limit because Forrest would have to do the screening himself. Alternatively, it would be nice if he could share general details with a few insiders that could assist with the initial screening.
Those that were close to the correct location get to move on to the next round which involves sending specific details about how they arrived at that location. Again, the word length of such descriptions should be within reason; No hundred-page manuscripts. Then, Forrest could judge those finalists and declare one or more "winners". He would never have to directly state the answer himself. Everyone else would get a standard "thank's for playing, but you did not have the correct solve".

This contest would thus:
1) Provide a form of answer on location and solution, even though it wouldn't be the "official" solve from the finder.
2) Give closure to those searchers who never had the opportunity to go BOTG to test their solves. A simple "way off" or "wrong state" would do wonders.

[zaphod73491]

Jul 16, 2020 12:23:13 GMT -5 annie said:

Didn’t Forrest once say something like the path for the person who solves it will be a sure one or be more ‘confident’ But harder for those who had not solved all the clues.

Hi Annie: it's from the backside of the Benchmark map in TFTW: "I warned that the path would not be direct for those who had no certainty of the location beforehand, but sure for the one who did."

There are a lot of ways to read that short sentence. For instance, in the final dependent clause he could simply be referring to himself. There is also the possibility that the second clause doesn't negate the first: that the path is both sure AND indirect, regardless of whether one has certainty of the location.

[Deleted]

Jul 16, 2020 13:33:01 GMT -5 zaphod73491 said:

Jul 16, 2020 12:23:13 GMT -5 annie said:

Didn’t Forrest once say something like the path for the person who solves it will be a sure one or be more ‘confident’ But harder for those who had not solved all the clues.

Hi Annie: it's from the backside of the Benchmark map in TFTW: "I warned that the path would not be direct for those who had no certainty of the location beforehand, but sure for the one who did."

There are a lot of ways to read that short sentence. For instance, in the final dependent clause he could simply be referring to himself. There is also the possibility that the second clause doesn't negate the first: that the path is both sure AND indirect, regardless of whether one has certainty of the location.

Jumping out on a limb here, but I like the definition of alter ego. Remember Snoopy? He had tons of different personalities. I'm thinking Forrest knows many a searcher who fits in with this description, especially those who contact him and then tell him how they're hiding behind a user name. Honestly, it could be any of us. Of course, that's just my foolish goofball opinion.

Note to self: Carry on my wayward son (or daughter)...

[dejoka]

Jul 16, 2020 13:33:01 GMT -5 zaphod73491 said:

Jul 16, 2020 12:23:13 GMT -5 annie said:

Didn’t Forrest once say something like the path for the person who solves it will be a sure one or be more ‘confident’ But harder for those who had not solved all the clues.

Hi Annie: it's from the backside of the Benchmark map in TFTW: "I warned that the path would not be direct for those who had no certainty of the location beforehand, but sure for the one who did."

There are a lot of ways to read that short sentence. For instance, in the final dependent clause he could simply be referring to himself. There is also the possibility that the second clause doesn't negate the first: that the path is both sure AND indirect, regardless of whether one has certainty of the location.

.. and I'll add that if you were wise, you would have found that the poem was self confirming and it's own blazed trail, from beginning to end, to a 100th of a second latitude precision. This is why the one was sure beforehand.

[indulgenceseeker]

Jul 16, 2020 7:42:46 GMT -5 marek said:

Jul 15, 2020 21:33:47 GMT -5 zaphod73491 said:

While the finder does risk getting his thunder stolen by a second solver if he waits too long to write his screenplay or get his TTOTC documentary/miniseries filmed, there may be more afoot. Here are just 3 possibilities that come to my mind:

1. He left something for the second finder, thus he's remaining silent
2. He solved it first, won the prize, doesn't care about monetizing the solution or find story, and thus doesn't care who comes in second or if they reveal their solution
3. He's confident that the searcher community is so far off-track that there's no hurry to tell his story

I still haven't come up with a satisfactory explanation for why Forrest congratulated everyone ELSE for participating, but gave no public kudos whatsoever to the finder for (apparently) being the first to solve what hundreds of thousands of others could not for over 9 years. That sounds very uncharacteristic of Forrest, making me question what transpired for him to not just downplay the finder's achievement, but ignore it altogether.

But your second possibility sounds pretty convincing to me.

I also agree that it's very strange that Forrest put it in such a way, that it immediately becomes clear that he does not congratulate the finder. First I have thought that the congratulations to the finder will come in a later statement of Forrest. But I guess there comes nothing more.

Until recently, I thought all those "the finder is not the solver" theories are nonsense. But in the meanwhile, I am not that confident anymore.



6 hours ago goldilocks said

"...he had used the clues in the poem and hints in the Memoir to locate and find the Chest."



www.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.azd.1241875/gov.uscourts.azd.1241875.15.1.pdf

If adopting Occam's razor as a guiding principle, Z's second possibility is the simplest, and therefore, most probable. And given that ff is a man of his word when he said he would not speak of this again we should assume, then, no satisfaction is forthcoming from either of them.

What I take from G's quote of ff's deposition above is that though the chest is no longer there, the right "solve" remains obscure. I think FF intentionally used other words in that statement to describe how Indulgence was found. And if I abandon the guiding principle of simplicity and grasp for the unnecessary, what I infer from ff's statement is the finder did not solve it the way he had wanted it to be or thought it would be.

Combined with the finder's shyness, the ending was a big letdown; it left ff unsatisfied for himself and for the search community; many long time observers commented on the sense of sadness in his post discovery statements. (Conjecture as to why no congratulation: It's possible the finder is vindictive out of spite for how they feel they were treated on the blogs...adding to ff's sadness.) However, finding out how it really went down may have to wait until principals are no longer with us.  

IMO, even though the treasure no longer lies below the blaze, the thrill of the chase continues in this hunt until the solve is no longer obscure. 


 

[zaphod73491]

Jul 16, 2020 14:04:03 GMT -5 dejoka said:

Jul 16, 2020 13:33:01 GMT -5 zaphod73491 said:

Hi Annie: it's from the backside of the Benchmark map in TFTW: "I warned that the path would not be direct for those who had no certainty of the location beforehand, but sure for the one who did."

There are a lot of ways to read that short sentence. For instance, in the final dependent clause he could simply be referring to himself. There is also the possibility that the second clause doesn't negate the first: that the path is both sure AND indirect, regardless of whether one has certainty of the location.

.. and I'll add that if you were wise, you would have found that the poem was self confirming and it's own blazed trail, from beginning to end, to a 100th of a second latitude precision. This is why the one was sure beforehand.

Gotta call you out on that one, Dejoka. One second of latitude is about 31 meters, so a 100th of a second is about a foot (roughly the size of the chest). Even if Forrest provided that level of precision in the poem, it would be empty precision. With rare exceptions (e.g. USGS benchmarks), the coordinates of a random spot in the Rockies aren't known to that level of precision, nor could you use a GPS to navigate to that precise a spot. About 15 feet of accuracy is the best you can do with GPS.

[goldilocks]

Jul 16, 2020 16:09:43 GMT -5 zaphod73491 said:

Jul 16, 2020 14:04:03 GMT -5 dejoka said:

.. and I'll add that if you were wise, you would have found that the poem was self confirming and it's own blazed trail, from beginning to end, to a 100th of a second latitude precision. This is why the one was sure beforehand.

Gotta call you out on that one, Dejoka. One second of latitude is about 31 meters, so a 100th of a second is about a foot (roughly the size of the chest). Even if Forrest provided that level of precision in the poem, it would be empty precision. With rare exceptions (e.g. USGS benchmarks), the coordinates of a random spot in the Rockies aren't known to that level of precision, nor could you use a GPS to navigate to that precise a spot. About 15 feet of accuracy is the best you can do with GPS.

Hi Zap. I think it's plausible that the poem could have gotten us to within a foot of the chest - thinking of The Gold Bug. I think if we were given exact coordinates (paces or feet) from a given monument or marker to the random spot in the Rockies, one could arrive within a foot of the chest. 

[annie]

Jul 16, 2020 13:33:01 GMT -5 zaphod73491 said:

Jul 16, 2020 12:23:13 GMT -5 annie said:

Didn’t Forrest once say something like the path for the person who solves it will be a sure one or be more ‘confident’ But harder for those who had not solved all the clues.

Hi Annie: it's from the backside of the Benchmark map in TFTW: "I warned that the path would not be direct for those who had no certainty of the location beforehand, but sure for the one who did."

There are a lot of ways to read that short sentence. For instance, in the final dependent clause he could simply be referring to himself. There is also the possibility that the second clause doesn't negate the first: that the path is both sure AND indirect, regardless of whether one has certainty of the location.

Thank you zaphod, I Like that quote. I think I understand it.  Though, it is in TFTW which is not one of the ‘essentials’ required to solve the riddle. 
However, we must take all the help we can -  better to have a small part of something, than no part ...etc.

if your solve begins at one point and takes a journey through a dangerous terrain ( for example, glacial lakes, No Trails, high peaks, no vehicular access) then continues down into a more amenable location, then, your starting point for your search would be a different location to where your solve began - rather than the ‘dangerous terrain’ and also WWWH). Perhaps a trailhead to a Forest Trail, under the mountains where the. WWH.

[dejoka]

Jul 16, 2020 16:09:43 GMT -5 zaphod73491 said:

Jul 16, 2020 14:04:03 GMT -5 dejoka said:

.. and I'll add that if you were wise, you would have found that the poem was self confirming and it's own blazed trail, from beginning to end, to a 100th of a second latitude precision. This is why the one was sure beforehand.n

Gotta call you out on that one, Dejoka. One second of latitude is about 31 meters, so a 100th of a second is about a foot (roughly the size of the chest). Even if Forrest provided that level of precision in the poem, it would be empty precision. With rare exceptions (e.g. USGS benchmarks), the coordinates of a random spot in the Rockies aren't known to that level of precision, nor could you use a GPS to navigate to that precise a spot. About 15 feet of accuracy is the best you can do with GPS.

Yep, amazing isn't it, that's the size I figured too, 10" x 10". I assume f's philosophy on the matter was, aim small, miss small. I don't believe the precise location size being the same size as "the perfect treasure chest" was coincidental.

Here's an interesting fact and confirmation concerning the physical Blaze's GPS coordinates. The sum of all the lat. and long. numbers: dd, mm, ss, and xx equals 360.

I did not concoct this solution or the 100th of a second latitude GPS coordinates, f gave us a blazed trail with confirmations, from beginning to end, I just followed his path precisely.

[dejoka]

Jul 16, 2020 18:59:12 GMT -5 dejoka said:

Jul 16, 2020 16:09:43 GMT -5 zaphod73491 said:

Gotta call you out on that one, Dejoka. One second of latitude is about 31 meters, so a 100th of a second is about a foot (roughly the size of the chest). Even if Forrest provided that level of precision in the poem, it would be empty precision. With rare exceptions (e.g. USGS benchmarks), the coordinates of a random spot in the Rockies aren't known to that level of precision, nor could you use a GPS to navigate to that precise a spot. About 15 feet of accuracy is the best you can do with GPS.

Yep, amazing isn't it, that's the size I figured too, 10" x 10". I assume f's philosophy on the matter was, aim small, miss small. I don't believe the precise location size being the same size as "the perfect treasure chest" was coincidental.

Here's an interesting fact and confirmation concerning the physical Blaze's GPS coordinates. The sum of all the lat. and long. numbers: dd, mm, ss, and xx equals 360.

I did not concoct this solution or the 100th of a second latitude GPS coordinates, f gave us a blazed trail with confirmations, from beginning to end, I just followed his path precisely.

BTW: I just threw down the gauntlet, if I'm right the finder should pick it up and proclaim the solution as soon as possible. If the finder doesn't announce the solution then I will assume I'm wrong and then I will write a fictional novel based on my imaginative interpretation of the solution.

To me, it's a win, win situation, as retirement is ever drawing nigh, I'll be needing something to do.

[Deleted]

Jul 16, 2020 12:27:20 GMT -5 dejoka said:

Jul 16, 2020 9:23:29 GMT -5 @ogitsumyw said:

Thats news to me since he has always said you will not know if your solve is correct unless you get the chest.  Otherwise, people would simply email solutions until he said "found".

And how would this have worked if he was dead?  20 years from now somone posts the correct solve, Forrest awakens from the dead, reads the solve, and then rewards the guy?  Remember, unless he is a liar, nobody knows where the treasure is or the solution, so that would include the law firm managing his estate.

Not sure why you guys seem entitled to something. You knew the rules since day one.

One thing I do enjoy is reading the solves people are posting, I liked your solve and was interesting in seeing the rest, but you never came through.  Not sure why, its well beyond 6/6/2020. 

Know what would be interesting?  Someone posts a solve after 6/6/2020, the finder then sues them for hacking his computer. LOL

I'm not sure where you think I said that I was entitled to something. What I am saying is, no one owns the solution to the Chase until it is published and that includes me, you, f, the finder and everyone else.

The only solution that matters is the one that the person with the chest has.  No other solve has any meaning, except to give the person an idea as to how close they were.  No awards are given for second place, and even if your solve matched the finder exactly, you are still second place because he solved it before you and more importantly he has the chest.  Nothing else matters... Nobody cares about what second place has to say (other than second place themselves, for example I would like to know how close I was, but I fully understand it means nothing in the big picture).

[Deleted]

Jul 16, 2020 15:00:39 GMT -5 @suzys said:

With all this talk about the finder, couldn't there be justifiable circumstances (which even Forrest was unaware of) preventing him (the finder) from coming forward? The finder would not be expected to divulge his life story, let alone to Forrest. Needless to say, there may be good reason why the solve is being held up.

I hate to say it, but the forums are already overloaded with negative comments, we don't need any more. The least someone could do is give the dum guy the benefit of the doubt, after all, it's no wonder why he's shy, he's stuck in the middle of all of this.

Just breath and the say Boogy Woogy Bugle Boy 3 times fast. Believe me, it helps! Ah... that's better...

Truth.  In fact, its none of our business what the finder does or why they do it.  If we are concerned that the state was not even given out, then that is to be taken up with Forrest, the finder just did what we were "challenged" to do.  For some reason, people think that everyone deserves a trophy and they are entitled to something from the finder, it is laughable.

[Deleted]

Jul 16, 2020 18:59:12 GMT -5 dejoka said:

Jul 16, 2020 16:09:43 GMT -5 zaphod73491 said:

Gotta call you out on that one, Dejoka. One second of latitude is about 31 meters, so a 100th of a second is about a foot (roughly the size of the chest). Even if Forrest provided that level of precision in the poem, it would be empty precision. With rare exceptions (e.g. USGS benchmarks), the coordinates of a random spot in the Rockies aren't known to that level of precision, nor could you use a GPS to navigate to that precise a spot. About 15 feet of accuracy is the best you can do with GPS.

Yep, amazing isn't it, that's the size I figured too, 10" x 10". I assume f's philosophy on the matter was, aim small, miss small. I don't believe the precise location size being the same size as "the perfect treasure chest" was coincidental.

Here's an interesting fact and confirmation concerning the physical Blaze's GPS coordinates. The sum of all the lat. and long. numbers: dd, mm, ss, and xx equals 360.

I did not concoct this solution or the 100th of a second latitude GPS coordinates, f gave us a blazed trail with confirmations, from beginning to end, I just followed his path precisely.

You mean "the finder followed the path precisely", you aren't the finder, nor is anyone posting here.  Nothing any of us say can be stated as "fact" because without the chest, none of us can claim to know for sure how to solve the poem.  That is  a fact.

[dejoka]

Jul 16, 2020 21:09:34 GMT -5 @ogitsumyw said:

Jul 16, 2020 12:27:20 GMT -5 dejoka said:

I'm not sure where you think I said that I was entitled to something. What I am saying is, no one owns the solution to the Chase until it is published and that includes me, you, f, the finder and everyone else.

The only solution that matters is the one that the person with the chest has.  No other solve has any meaning, except to give the person an idea as to how close they were.  No awards are given for second place, and even if your solve matched the finder exactly, you are still second place because he solved it before you and more importantly he has the chest.  Nothing else matters... Nobody cares about what second place has to say (other than second place themselves, for example I would like to know how close I was, but I fully understand it means nothing in the big picture).

I'm content being in second place.

[Deleted]

Jul 16, 2020 21:15:33 GMT -5 dejoka said:

Jul 16, 2020 21:09:34 GMT -5 @ogitsumyw said:

The only solution that matters is the one that the person with the chest has.  No other solve has any meaning, except to give the person an idea as to how close they were.  No awards are given for second place, and even if your solve matched the finder exactly, you are still second place because he solved it before you and more importantly he has the chest.  Nothing else matters... Nobody cares about what second place has to say (other than second place themselves, for example I would like to know how close I was, but I fully understand it means nothing in the big picture).

I'm content being in second place.

I am too, and thats my point,  neither of us can make any claims because we do not know the solution.